Thursday, 19 October 2017

FINANCE DEPT. FRUSTRATED BY NALCOR'S FAILED HEDGES

Not surprisingly when politicians and public servants screw up, and their error is exposed, the excuse register gets pretty crowded. That was the case when this Blog revealed that Nalcor lost $66.9 million on a hedging scheme in which it speculated on $1.82 billion of the most recent $2.9 billion Federal Loan Guarantee - funding for the Muskrat Falls project.

On NTV, August 21, 2017 CEO Stan Marshall defended the loss - suggesting nothing would have been said had it been a win. 

Of course, Marshall was mute about Nalcor's expertise in this complex and risky field. He did not mention if he had given any guidelines (limitations) to his officials - now speculators with the public purse.

Nor did he comment on whether those decisions are given over to some investment advisor with no skin in the game. And he offered no data as to the frequency of the Corporation's hedges. And, which would have been nice, he didn't confirm if – over time - wins/losses had evened out.

Certainly, there was no mention of Nalcor’s $14.1 million loss (including fees) reported in its December 31, 2013 Financial Statement . The losses were recorded on nine hedge contracts worth $2 billion entered into between December 3-6, 2013. 
There was only a jocular CEO making light of the transactions for the NTV reporter and the camera.




Even Premier Dwight Ball got into the act. In the same coverage of the issue by NTV, Ball attempted to give the crown corporation some cover going as far as to say that hedging was a common practice for Nalcor adding "what we need to do is look at the costs of not doing (the hedge)".  
Evidently, the Premier didn't realize that not entering into the contract would have saved the province a loss of $66.9 million!

NTV reporter, Michael Connors, must have swallowed his tongue on that one.

Related:
Nalcor Loses $66.9-million In 6 Day Failed Hedging Scheme. Public Not Told.


If it's OK for Nalcor and common practice for the Corporation to engage in hedging schemes, the obvious question is: where are the gains to be found?

And, why does only only Nalcor hedge?

It can't be due to its uncommon timing or success!

How had Emera, for example, assessed the need to play in the futures market to hedge bonds for financing the Labrador Island Link?

Nalcor disclosed in a September 27, 2017 email to a citizen sleuth - the one who noted Nalcor's attempt to obscure the $66.9 million loss (they couldn't have been proud!) - that "No hedge contracts were executed in the Labrador-Island Link Limited Partnership in which Emera has an interest."  (bold added)



Emera President and CEO Chris Huskilson had better sense than to let inexperienced staff think the shareholders' funds were just play-money.

Next, let's ask: what is the Government's Department of Finance experience - success or failure - with its hedging program? 
Surely the Premier doesn't differentiate monies raised by Nalcor and those raised for general government purposes. It is all "government money", isn't it?
Well, the same citizen sleuth, took that question to the Department of Finance, too.

The province has been borrowing money hand-over-fist in recent years including to fund Nalcor's equity for oil related 'investments' (I hate using the word ‘investment’ when it comes to Nalcor!) and for Muskrat Falls. In fact, the Province floated a $500 million bond issue on December 7, 2016.        

What did the Department of Finance say about hedging that one - and other - bond issues?


The Finance Department advised... and these are direct quotes: 
1)      "There were no hedges associated with GNLs bond issue on Dec 7 2016."  
2)      "There were no hedges associated with any of GNLs outstanding bond issues."
3)      "We can confirm...we do not have any hedges in place even on our US denominated
         debt." 
The words "even on our US denominated debt" could be reasonably interpreted as bewilderment as to who is minding the Nalcor store.


Many Nalcor watchers - but not Marshall or the Premier - share the same concern. It’s tough to imagine that, even after having effectively bankrupted the province, the government has failed to put handcuffs on Nalcor's ability to do further damage.
Little wonder that the Finance Department might be more than a little frustrated.

45 comments:

  1. How can Nalcor continue to operate beyond scrutiny given the sordid history of waste, incompetence and secrecy? Apparently neither Dwight or Stan care about the treasury, all that seems to matter is the secrecy and continuing the gravy train without public scrutiny.

    How can this gang that can't shoot straight be allowed to continue with the lies, the bumbling and the absolute secrecy? Who will tell Dwight that in a democracy public disclosure is not optional, it is the lifeblood that you are allowing to bleed out? Who will tell Stan that he had better open the books to scrutiny on the contractors and contracts or he can take full time, not part time, residence in the Caribbean?

    This cannot be allowed to continue.

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  2. Darker and darker grow the woods whether we are going forwards or backwards. Ineptitude and stupidity is what got us caught the last time so it is no surprise that the fools learned nothing from our shared history and being incredibly inept now they simply can’t learn anything anyway. Leadership is in serious want. The arse is almost out of her. The time for peaceful civil disobebiencd is on us. We need a plan. Now. Waiting is no longer an option. Let us look back to the great peaceful revolutions of the recent pqst. Let us learn from Ghandi, Mandela, Walensa.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. We need to get David Vardy a sackcloth outfit to lead the march to Province House!

      Delete
    2. "Idle no more" worked for the Indigenous. Remember Gord Downie. Read John Ralston Sauls', "Comeback". There are lots of examples of civil disobedience. Don't pay your power bill. Find alternatives to baseboard heating.

      Delete
  3. Folks, this is a Canadian disease.

    The whole setup of allowing a political party, under the first past the post system, manipulate power rates, generation, and distribution, produces the likes of Muskrat, many times over;

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/kathleen-wynne-hydro-auditor-emails-1.4360989

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    1. it may be a Canadian disease Robert, but NL has a lethal case. In all these cases it is not the inherent inability to provide a cost effective service, it is the secrecy that facilitates the political manipulation that is the enabler of this corruption.

      We need unfettered access to information to restore democratic oversight. FOIA's need to be opened up in all but the most restricted circumstances. We can no longer depend on the media to inform the population and hold the powerful to account.

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    2. Agreed, but the Ontario case of the cancelled gas fired plant has taken 10 years to get into the courts. NL has a chance to change the next government, and open the books in 2(?) years. Can the progressives not demand better, open, government, such as BC seems to have recently done? Lessons learned need to be brought to the electorate.

      Delete
    3. Hey NL, think of the possibilities!

      http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-41675801

      Coalitions can really work.

      Delete
  4. A pleasant surprise yesterday:
    As an investor, I do ok. I, for the most part, purchase blue chip stocks that pay a good dividend. For this reason, I margin some, that is, I also borrow money to invest, but not too much margin, as it can go against you in a town turn. Margins can improve your bottom line....my present limit is to borrow not more than 20 percent, though the broker will allow up to 70 percent of assets.
    My broker account recently shows performance averaged over the last 5 years. It was 15.1 percent average gain, well outpacing the market avg gain. My margin interest rate is about 2.5 percent, below what Nalcor pays.
    If Nalcor had prudently invested the many billions, instead of wasting it, it would have gained billions for the province.
    But that would mean no gravy train that has existed under Nalcor.

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    1. ahhh, don't mean to be rude but not exactly sure what your point is:

      "If Nalcor had prudently invested the many billions, instead of wasting it, it would have gained billions for the province."

      soo, you are suggesting Nalcor should become a hedge fund do invest the billions it borrowed to take a leveraged position in stocks?

      That would be a bold initiative

      Delete
  5. Lol...a pipe dream... But agree you go invest your money, borrowed or otherwise. You make money or loose money....none of my business. But tell you what buddy, government, NALCOR ain't investing my money (public money) or gambling my money away, in hopes of making big. Yes I know govt. money for pension plans etc is invested, but hopefully not in high risk. And anyone gettin 15 per cent is in high risk, and usually yo make some loose some even the professionals, but that's your personal business, not mine. NALCOR , govt has already invested /gambled too much, close to possible bankruptcy of a province. Rolled the dice, and still doing it ...and the are only armatures ... So will lose our shirts for us.

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    1. Nalcor's easy access to the public purse with little or no scrutiny from those controlling the treasury pretty well guarantees you and I have absolutely no control over our ballooning debt.They spend our money as they see fit. With nobody being held accountable for any actions of current and former politicians and current (and probably former) Nalcor executives we and our future generations will have this albatross forever around our collective necks. It is absolutely shameful the way we are being exploited to fill the pockets of those involved and the massive ego of the "exalted one" and no one attempting to protect our interests. Whether admitted or not everyone knows MF should never have seen the light of day. It will cause massive outmigration of our children and grandchildren because they simply will not be able to afford to live here, plain and simple. Those who still have their heads in the sand are in for a very rude awakening. Not only will our power bills double (triple?)but everything else in this helpless province will increase in cost. I wouldn't doubt for a minute that we will eventually see food taxed. We could have a very lucrative tourist industry but for the deplorable roads they have to drive over to see the advertised sights all because we have no money to do the needed upkeep. We have gasoline with taxes being taxed to try and get a few more dollars to pay for the idiocy of politicians who try to get reelected so as to ensure they get a lucrative pension and to ensure the Nalcors of this province have money enough to spend frivously--imagine signing on to "Cost Plus" contracts on a project the size of MF with the unimaginable penalty of being forced out with the hardship of a $6M severance package and everyone else looking out for everyone else. I dread the day when payback for the reckless spending starts. Those who conceived, sanctioned and are still exploiting us should burn in hell (after their jail terms are finished).
      Mr. Ball, I hope and pray that the upcoming inquiry is for the right reasons and not for political backscratching.

      God help us!!

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  6. To anon @13:08 who says LOL a pipe dream, anyone getting 15 percent is in high risk .even professionals win some loose some.

    Here is present holdings in one account, another account varies a little .
    Blackberry -16% 6 % of total holdings
    CIBC +125 % 28 %
    VIP +113 % 3%
    National Bank +64 % 5%
    Royal Bank +311 % 34%
    Toronto Dom Bk +246% 24%

    Royal and TD has been held approx 20 years, the others more recent.
    Blackberry and VIP are somewhat risky, but less than 10 percent of total. Only down on one.
    I did not intend to suggest that Nalcor invest for us, as they are incompetent at most everything, but pension plans etc invest......and likely do fair , but not this good.
    My point is to show what is possible......... when investing Warren Buffett style, good stocks, low risk, high returns vs what govn and Nalcor is doing with our money.
    A pipe dream? hardly.
    No capital gains while you hold for decades. Dividends reinvested and taxed very low. A sweet dream..........not a pipe dream.
    Of course most of these stock are presently riding high......so caution is the advise at present.......but long term.........excellent.
    Another account has more of BCE, a consistent good blue chip, like banks, but none in this account.
    Little high risk on these. Guess you missed the boat Anon.

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  7. Congrats! Seems you are a very successful investor, maybe you have an excellent broker or maybe you are your own advisor, so that account is quite successful, you mentioned another similar. Do you have any accounts that show losses, etc. But was not my intent to challenge your personal skills, successs investing in stocks, as I said none if my business. Maybe you could be my advisor, lol. As my point was the same as yours, I don't want NALCOR investing/gambling my money(public money) that hive no world class expertise in that area either, but maybe they think they do, and have no problem dabbling in the market, and loosing yours and my money. Keep on trucking, you have luck or you are a warren Buffett ...

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  8. Investing in the stock market is gambling and don't forget that the gambler, well he broke even. However there is absolutely no getting out of this world with your money, forget it, it ain't happening folks!!

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  9. Anon@ 17:13
    1.I learned the hard way not to trust brokers, I am my own adviser , sort of with Buffett as a mentor, his methods.
    2. I get an excellent interest rate on margin.......
    3. About 7 accounts I handle as a hobby, at no charge, others are for family members who lack the skills , any loss is in similar stocks stated, which are small percentage of the assets , So all show overall good result. I invest in no more than 10 stocks. I check it about once a month, as so little risk.
    4. For past 12 months average gain is about 19 percent
    5. For year to date: about 13.5 percent gain ( shows for comparison from the broker reports: TXS as 5.54 % gain and SP 500 @ 8.1 percent gain year to date
    6. For past 30 days my gain about 4 %, and is unusual gain recently.

    You said such gains a pipe dream........and must be high risk nature. These stocks are almost as good as the bank, as many are bank stocks. I guess much of the borrowing for MF ends up as bank profit. I can't help that........just that banks take little risk...guaranteed by the prov and feg govn. I rather their profits were not from MF.

    To Anom @ 17;25.......you say stock market is gambling. It can be gambling or an investment. In the 1929 crash many dropped 90 percent. Other times 50 percent. You gamble if you get in or out at the wrong time and act irrationally, or margin too high. Not necessary to margin at all. Canadian banks have endured well over a century......how much assurance do you want..........one alternative , put money under your mattress.
    As to not getting out of this world with your money gains....... an idiot knows that. Leave money to someone and part to the tax man. That's fine.
    But what about debts...........57 years worth.......as by Nalcor and MF...... massive debts passed along to those behind.
    Where is our oil legacy fund.......a debt spiral via MF .
    If only our public funds achieved some of what I show possible, is my point. That Wade Locke , the head of the economics dept at MUN endorsed this boondoggle................should be tarred and feathered!........Or a public flogging as UG would say.

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    1. What self congratulatory poppycock from an anon troll! Words of wisdom " You gamble if you get in or out at the wrong time and act irrationally, or margin too high".

      Two things; your 20% margin can lose all 100% of your money and much more in no time. The really big, self stroking whopper is it is only a gamble if you are in and out at the wrong time. Good one Nostradamus!

      Delete
    2. Bruno,
      You are obvious a very low risk guy, and I have probably too high a risk tolerance, but have moderated.
      If in blue chip stock and you own 100 dollars worth and borrow 20 more.......and the stock drops 50 percent, it is still worth 60 dollars, you still owe 20 and you own 40..........so far from losing 100 percent. How often do you see a blue chip drop 50 percent.
      Here is my performance:
      RSP accounts ; gains about 11 percent
      Margin accounts as follows
      Margin at 7 percent, gain about 14 percent 5 year average
      Margin at 18 percent , gain about 18 percent, 5 year avg
      Margin at 60 percent , gain about 24 percent , 5 year avg

      Of total holdings, most is at 7 percent margin, much less in an account at 60 percent. Accounts are cross linked to guarantee each other, so 60 percent is protected by others
      Avg of all is 15 percent margin, down from by self imposed rule of 20 percent.
      I do not advise anyone to margin if you prefer low risk or chose poor stocks.
      I had been at higher risk in the past, margined at 50 percent, at the time of the 2008 crash. Assets dropped 55 percent, but no margin call from the broker, and kept a close eye on things. Rather than abandon investing, things recovered, and up about 400 percent since 2008. But lesson learned......I was at too high a margin. I have reduced the margin as stated, with good results.
      The good gains is reflected in the moderate margins used, but I advise no one to margin, as there is risk, but not high risk with blue chip stocks.
      As to wrong time: market is now frothy, so not a good time to jump in big.
      2009 was a good time to get in, when the market had a big drop and stock undervalued.
      By irrational, I mean, many get in when markets are very high, or sell off when stocks are overly depressed. Not wise......and shows greed and fear.
      Buffett started investing at age 14, was selling newspapers, and claimed his bike as an expense. Today net worth 75 billion, and gave away over 25 billion. 40,000 show up each year for his annual AGM.
      He does not buy penny stock.
      I am small fry, having stated late compared to him......
      Result I state are factual. My few losses are mostly on green stocks, as many are slow to show profits, like solar, that in time will profit, but I do some in this, consistent with my view of the waste on the boondoggle.
      Maybe I do better than Wade Locke to give advise.....
      Of course you or readers might consider this poppycock or if true a boast.
      Another investor might estimate whether my choice and gains and margins are reasonably sound. You seen to lack investing knowledge to make a judgement.
      Perhaps you could compare my risk to that of Nalcor. They hoped for 8 percent return on MF .......and Dave Vardy or PlanetNL is painting a different story. Poor Wade Locke is going to confession.
      Economics....Bruno.........I dabble and do good, but we are led by Locke rationale.
      INVESTOR


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    3. Finally I have understood my mistake. I did not write off my bicycle and little red wagon from my paper route (with the Toronto Telegram). Who knew it could have led to 57 billion?

      I should take investment advice from anon trolls more often.

      Delete
    4. Bruno,
      If you do not know the value of gains compounded year after year, look it up. See the value in starting young.
      Nothing anom about Buffett and his 75 billion.....you got the numbers backwards saying 57.......confused with the 57 take or pay Nalcor scheme.
      I benefited from Buffetts free advise.......ignore me, and study up on Buffett........you are trapped in Locke`s foolishness.
      There are many anoms .........if I give my name , I would need to install a security device on my home, etc.
      I have briefly stated the how to, and the type of stock.......you want me to hold your hand......
      We have real economists follow UG......see if they are critical of my approach. I even have holdings of National Bank.....maybe Bernard could say if that is wise.
      INVESTOR

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    5. So if you put a name to your free advice you would be flooded with persons seeking their fortune at your home? I am sure Warren can teach you to Buffet the crowds (so to speak).

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    6. I sometimes don`t lock my house doors, never bother to lock my car doors in the driveway, and have never had a breakin, ever. Why advertise my good luck like those winning the ACE. I don`t mistrust people generally........but
      My MF levi tax and increased dividend tax is up substantial with this boondoggle......but still a resident.
      My point that you don`t get is that the economics of MF as an investment, producing gravy, is so laughable.
      My example is not typical, but true, and shows how bad MF is an an investment. Simple as that.
      Some (very few) may check my figures and benefit from it, if so fine. If not , fine also.
      Perhaps I missed my calling and became a full time investor, but that ship has sailed at my stage in life. Maybe I shoild seek Locke`s job.
      Double power rates I can afford, but most cannot.
      I will leave it at that. If I was not concerned, I would relocate to another province with lower tax rates.
      INVESTOR

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  10. Hi, you are doing great in my books...yes, can't loose on bank stocks, if you have the patience and preservence, and an investment to begin with...think you have it all under control. Cheers...but really a different conversation than the muskrats.

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  11. Generally your are right, just than good governance needs competence, and we need to assess what is possible, and that a culture of prudence is badly needed...........we seem to have squandered an opportunity for some prosperity, by a really bad gabble with the public purse.

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  12. Oh my goodness! A call to social arms goes quickly into investment lessons!
    The great social divide, the colonizers and the colonized, didn’t go away.
    Investors and proletariat, rise up!
    Winter is coming, the dark days of enforced poverty, the long 60 years of it, is starting and all
    we do is gripe and take umbrage at one another’s gripes.

    WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO?
    WHEN?

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    1. Tor
      I am a socialist at heart, and a MF naysayer, and a capitalist in practice, and wish to put much of my good luck to social use.
      I oppose the idea of colonizers. In quantity, I am hit more than most with higher taxes this past few years, and do not complain.....as the well off, by policy, get significant tax breaks.
      I have benefited not one cent from MF contracts, and pity all who have to pay for this mess. The poor are as silent as the rich, as to MF. It is the rich that should be yelling what a waste this has been, yet the BOT crowd, and most all have been silent.
      It is the those on the social divide that cheer led MF and benefited and remain silent as to the boondoggle that should be your concern.
      I an not "I'm all right , Jack"....... frame of mind, as I am as concerned about the negative impact of MF as many on this blog.
      The investment lesson is meant to illustrate how bad our govn and Nalcor has been in handling the public purse.
      I see a vast difference in two rich men, Trump and Warren Buffett. I admire Buffett more for what he gives back than for his investment ability...............maybe you don't see the difference.
      I am of the opinion that we lack an enterpreneur base in this province that would counter so much dependence on government employment, especially rural areas.
      Investors like me, is no substitute for that......job creators, with sound ideas....that as in NS....would have been heard opposing such a mad scheme as happened here.

      Delete
    2. A call to social arms turns into a lesson on investments says Tor, suggesting this is inappropriate.
      A call to social arms.........what does this mean......peaceful protests against Muskrat Falls project certainly because it is unaffordable, unsafe, and unnesessry.
      Unsafe due to the North Sour, the methylmercury issue, and relaibility issues as to the transmission.
      Unnecessary because it was never least cost, and forecasts demands were vastly inflated.
      Unaffordable, because it is extremely high cost power, a project that can never pay for itself, a risk and a gamble, toted by DW to be a roll of the dice, so not in any way an investment.
      An investment needs to pass the scrutiny of prudence, that was entirely absent from this project, as outlined by David Vardy.
      So, this project received sanction to proceed, absent any resemblance of being an investment.
      So, is it not appropriate to consider lessons on investments, something badly needed in Nfld , in both provincial and municipal governments.
      UG states the promoting of good governance is an important part of this blog. Good governance demands good financial management, and is the concern of the present piece. Appropriate spending, borrowing and INVESTMENTS are core components of good governance.
      Fortis invests, Nalcor gambles. Gambles are faced with unacceptable risks. Investments have reasonable risks, that are unlikely to turn into a boondoggle.
      I suggest that too few Nflders know the difference, a lesson hard learned. Lessons in investments........certainly needed.
      PF

      Delete
    3. I don't know about you, but I'll be voting with my feet.

      Delete
  13. Des, you might want to correct a typo. The link in red to the original story seems to be missing a decimal. It states that the loss was $669 M instead of 66.9 M.

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  14. Saturday morning news:
    I observe the high sea level in the cove, Quilty`s Cove, that I am totally familiar with for over 60 years. It is calm, yet the sea covers rocks 2 ft higher than normal. I assume part of this is high tide, maybe from the moon. But this past week of more it has been like that, and the frequency much more common this past 10 years. Where I could walk to the place, with sneakers, one often now need rubber boots. Not unlike Miami where streets flood, only my house is 75 ft above the sea, and most of Florida nearly as sea level. In the past 50 years, the sea is supposed to have risen 6 inches, but seems more than that here. Rocks now always kelp covered that were once always bare.
    And few believe in man made global warming.
    Then I go to the Telegram , online.
    The first item is that Wade Locke says how bad things are in Nfld, all over. For bad things we are at the top. He cites health care expenditures as a big problem, saying we need a Royal Commission.
    I wish he says ` I resign, having given bad advise to the government.`
    Instead he says we need the Inquiry on Muskrat Falls.That the demand projections for power were wrong.

    My God Almighty.......what a revelation! After UG , Vardy and others calling for an Inquiry forever, and one finally being called, he now says we need one. The gall of that man. Can we find the source of that gall and cut it out......is there a specialist on Eastern Health for that.
    In 2012 I emailed Locke.......as to my analysis on power demands, that newer heating technology will scuttle the use of baseboard heaters. He, apparently could not give an opinion on that as he could not get time to read my 8 page presentation presented to the PUB.
    Locke......still head hancho of the economics department at MUN.
    As he said......in Nfld , we are at the top of the list for all the worse things. Well said Wade. Print it on your T-shirt, and wear it before your students.
    Winston Adams

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    1. Was Locke a paid world class expert for NALCOR at that time.a guy thT talked in circles and said nothing in the end, except muskrat was the lowest cost option that NALCOR and the government paid him to say. He did no research or analyst of the power need at the time or into the future, but was on a pedistal by NALCOR, the government and mun. The silly fools everyone of them . And I aM not a guy in the know, but way back in 2010 I knew they all told lies and half truths, because the first question was do we need the power and they alll by passed that question as a no brainer that called it, of course we need the power, and that knew exactly where to get it as the lowest cost option of only one option, that's why I called them silly fools, they earned their name. And now they are being touted again as the experts, that know all about healt care, demographics, and the public purse. What a bunch the elete promote. Come on bot belly up to the bar...

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  16. A propos the Finance Department may be a little frustrated, today's article by Pam Frampton has a savagely ironic quote.

    Law prof Leblanc in commenting on Nalcor board's refusal to disclose contractors salaries said "Other public projects trend towards accountability". D'ya think professor?

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  17. Look up the word FOMENT
    Check the rebellions and revolutions list on Wikipedia
    Raise the fist
    Bring on the orators

    Gee, these days I miss Ray Guy and Randy Joyce
    I wonder what Joey would say?

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  18. This video gives a fascinating vision of the future of distributed decentralized generation outside the existing grid in Puerto Rico in the rebuilding after Maria.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvJMs5sEwYw

    Compare that future (now being created in PR) to being chained to the Nalcor MF monopoly for 60 years. If one substitutes NL's abundant wind plus battery storage for Puerto Rico's solar on localized microgrids it is easy to see that NL can allow Nalcor, NL Hydro, NPower all to become insolvent for the poor planning and grid maintenance and build a modern network of microgrids outside the decadent existing system.

    It would be much cheaper and more socially equitable than the hardship and despair that will be inflicted with 23 cent KwH (with 2% a year added) for energy.

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  19. Bruno, I believe wind with battery storage is now below 10 cent power, but existing island hydro is more like 3 or 4 cent cost, so we need not neglect our good hydro resource here. But more wind was a important missed opportunity for us..........
    To replace 500 Mw thermal: 78 hydro, 200 wind with storage, 225 conservation via efficiency........that simple. Time frame, wind 18 months, hydro 3 year, efficiency, 8-10 year.So all complete by 2020 if started in 2012.
    By the way.....Home Depot has Rheem heat pump hot water heaters tanks for 1199.00. GE used to be like 1800.00,but sold their plant to others. Efficiency factor 3.5 vs .93 for regular tank. Energy use per year about 108.00 vs 400.00 for hot water.
    These best for warmer climates, but operate down to 37F ambient outdoor. There are ways to use this year round here.
    Take Charge do not acknowledge such technology exist ( been around for some 10 years, about 5 different mfgs. They prefer plastic for windows and foam tape for doors.......right high tech stuff.
    WA

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  20. The generation must be looked at as a whole Winston. It is a financial and technical nightmare, with a neglected infrastructure tied to Muskrat Madness. The only way to save NL may be to liquidate the whole thing and start again with decentralized microgrids.

    There are wind entrepreneurs that have been eager to go for years in NL. In consultation with Musk they can build out microsystems. You can do the same building out a delivery system from those existing hydro facilities. Those PENG's can get some redemption by building out the future.

    There are alternatives now Winston. Nalcor and the bond holders can be left holding the flaming bag of dog doo doo they have left at NL's front door.

    The point is alternatives to out of control energy prices now exists.

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  21. The problem with NL Dept of Finance is that the dimwitted politicians in charge of that wretched entity are more worried about being able to borrow money than they are about being able to pay down debt.

    They're just like a bunch of naive little children in need of supervision... they can't manage their own affairs. This tortured province would be much better off if a group of retired Norwegian civil servants were put in charge, and get rid of those bloody fools... these dimwits and culprits... who've made such a royal mess of it with their piss-poor governance.

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  22. Here is another interesting topic. Could we benifit, grow our population our economy etc. By having a permanent or fixed link to the mainland . Some call it linking Labrador to the island but think those are the ones that want us to remain an island and try to belittle the link and the cost being not worth the benifits. Others call it a link to nowhere, as there is no highway along the north shore of Quebec. Build the tunnel and Ottawa and Quebec will build the highway, make no mistake. I get a kick out of every parent in the province wanting their child being in French classes, how many go on to become bilingual. Think the número is minuscule. Think every person that went to lab west should have been required to take French lesson, conversational that is, we complain than no nl can't work on the other side of the boarder because they can't pass the safety course in French. So much or immersion, lol, what a laugh, lol. We should embrace our nearest neighbour not ridicule or bad mouth them. Can anyone believe that in this day and age. And no I am not attacking the French immersion program, but rather the general attitude of the public elite, that think sin Jains is the center of the English universe. So I say build the tunnel and let the entire province flourish from st. Anthony to port aux basques to the Avalon Nd not just in sin Janus. Yes, I live in is jauns too. Lol

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  23. Nalcor was doing quite well then the Liberals took power fired or forced out all who knew how to run the corporation. Patronage kicked in top gear. Liberals now are even pushing wind power at 3 times the cost of oil. Worked out so well in Ontario ... for campaign funds kicked back by friends.

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  24. OMG...you sound so much like Bob on open line!!!!!

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  25. Bruno
    As to distributed microgrids
    We have considerble distributed microgrids, like 100 MW of small hydro by Nfld power. Many other of island hydro are scattered,which is good for reliability.
    Apart from Holdrood thermal, we have a good system, when maintained.
    But there is room for improvements for further micro grid additions.
    To suggest starting from scratch........seems off base.
    One advantage of microsystems is the load close to the generation, so reduced transmission losses. Small wind in not cost effective relative to utility scale wind.
    Reductions of loads from conservation and efficiency also serves this purpose of reducing transmission losses. Reduction of loads is 3 times cheaper on average than any new generation. Not sure you appreciate that this as much more cost effective than either wind, solar or storage ( though such new generation is getting more effective than long distance transmission and generation)
    Priority number 1 , by far the cost effective is conservation and efficiency........whether you agree..........
    If so, then the cost effectiveness of any new renewable generation should be priority 2
    Little assessment of these options permitted the bambozzle of residents toward the MF fiasco.
    How to correct this going forward.....the 15 billion dollar question........requires an informed debate, minus the Nalcor crowd.But Nfld Hydro being again independent, and Efficiency corp to prevent the inherent conflict of interest with all power companies.

    Winston

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  26. This is the second Wind Turbine development I have read about in the last 24 hours. I find it rather peculiar and disturbing that we have missed the boat on wind generated electricity while the New England states have embraced it with such vigor. To make matters more interesting it involves Statoil one of the bigger players here in the offshore oil industry. It makes me wonder if the oil companies are looking else where for major opportunities rather than drilling for oil.

    https://www.renewableenergymagazine.com/wind/empire-wind-will-provide-power-to-empire-20171024

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